Submitted by Jeff Schuler on Sat, 12/06/2008 - 16:32.
Franks house was not demolished. Upper-level windows have been removed. I'm not sure what else.
Frank was arrested and held in jail for about 3 days, then threatened arrest again.
He was in his parked car with his dog last night, and when I returned this morning. The workers (that he believes were scrapping the aluminum from his windows) were not there today. He mentioned concern for his cats and dog and the belongings in his house.
He believes his rights have been violated by the city, and could use representation.
CPD: 2 carjackings, 2 rapid-response arrests and recoveries
CLEVELAND - An off-duty female security guard was carjacked at gunpoint about 4:50 p.m. Monday. Within minutes, the suspects were arrested and her car -- with her gun inside -- was returned, thanks to speedy police work. That same fast action reunited a toddler with her mother Sunday, when another carjacker took a car that held the woman's sleeping daughter. Police said this is what happened Monday: A 39-year-old Northfield woman was visiting family on Central Avenue. She was getting things out of the trunk of her Ford Contour. Two men walked up. One pulled out a silver semi-automatic handgun and ordered her to give up her keys. She did. The men drove the car to the 2000 block of West 25th Street, where, at 5:09 p.m., they robbed the Game Shop at gunpoint. They fled with money and merchandise. Cleveland patrol officers spotted the Contour within minutes near West 44th Street and Lorain Avenue. The suspects tried to flee, but crashed into another car. They bailed and ran. Officers chased them and had them in handcuffs at 5:19 p.m. The suspects refused to identify themselves. They're being held at the jail. Police returned the woman's car, her gun and the Game Shop property.
-----------------------------------------
Commander Sulzer advised me that after the two males bailed and ran, one was caught on Bridge Court (the alley north of Bridge) and the other was caught on Bailey. There were 13 officers that worked togther to apprehend these males though some very quick action. This was a great bust, and not only are two bad guys off the street, 3 guns are off the street as well (there was a gun in the trunk of the stolen car). I will be obtaining the names of the suspects for Court Watch purposes and keeping this email list posted.
2) We have $261.60 in the Police Appreciation Fund. Instead of spending this on food for the officers working Christmas Eve, I am following Commander Sulzer's suggestion to use this money to periodically recognize officers for outstanding service to the community. I plan to recognize two general patrol officers who work Zone 212 in our area. They were also involved in the apprehension and arrest of the 2 males in the above report. They will be recognized for their outstanding day-to-day service to our community. I'll provide details at a later date.
3) For those of you that read the January edition of the Plain Press, some crucial facts were omitted from a particular article, "Frank Giglio's historic house demolished while police guard the W.14th Street site". The following facts were omitted, as per Commander Sulzer:
A demolition crew at the W.14th house called the police to report that the homeowner threatened their lives, and that they found shotgun shells in the house. This is the real reason why police responded to this site. Police responded and seized an illegal sawed-off shotgun found in an upstairs closet, and seized the live shotgun shells found on his dining room table. The owner was arrested for aggravated menacing.
The report states that "they (the police) pulled a gun on his dog and he (the owner) rescued the dog from being killed". Commander Sulzer was there, and observed an unleashed pit bull exit the house and charge towards him. Commander Sulzer kicked a nearby soccer ball at the dog to distract it, but it came back at him again. The owner was ordered to secure his animal, preventing the officers from having to use deadly force to protect themselves. The officers could have shot this dog, but they didn't.
When the owner returned to the site after his release from jail, the police were required to keep this site secured, and had reasonable suspicion to assume that the owner might be capable of further threats of aggravated menacing. The police were required to be there, in order to protect the workers on the site, as well as the owner. Failure to secure the site could be considered a dereliction of duty on the part of the officers. Bottom line: They were doing their job!
I think it is important to report these facts, especially since the Plain Press is widely distributed in our community. I contacted the Plain Press to report these facts before they would run the article and they refused to verify them with Commander Sulzer or include the facts in their article. The reason why the Plain Press failed to do so is that they consider Commander Sulzer to be (and I quote) "a non credible source" for this article. This Plain Press article is making its way into various blogs, and there is no one there to report these facts or defend the actions of the CPD. I feel it is appropriate for this email list to know the other side of the story.
Bob Shores
OCNW Safety & Outreach Coordinator
PH 781-3222 (ext. 103)
Fax 781-3252
bshores [at] ohiocity [dot] org
A FRIEND OF MINE FROM OHIO CITY THOUGHT I WOULD FIND THIS INFO INTERESTING AND I JUST THOUGHT I WOULD PASS IT ON.
Submitted by Norm Roulet on Thu, 01/01/2009 - 03:07.
I'm really glad to see the Cleveland police communicate with some of the community by email, and this is an informative and professional communication. I'm glad you posted it.
I can understand demo crews and police being concerned about going anywhere near a man being thrown out on the street, from his home, who certainly will be overwhelmingly upset, and may have a shotgun... that is a recipe for intentional and unintentional killings.
That Cleveland "leadership" allowed police and citizens to be in such risk to acellerate a dubious if not unlawful demo is disgraceful. If I was a cop put in that situation I would be pissed.
I've never considered the police a cause of the problem here, from what I've read.
The problems are the people who put Franks property at the front of the line for demo, and those who gave them the motivation and money and political amunition to do that, and those who did not defend it for historical importance, and those who did not help Frank out of human or even godly goodness, and those who stole physical property of his, and those who menaced him in any unreasonable way, which seems to easily add up to 20-30 real shitty human beings, with real names and plans for their futures, running around our community, taking community money, and screwing over someone certainly under duress, if not mental impairment.
Perhaps if some these 20-30 people come forward and take responsibility and clear their names, we can get Frank's life in much better shape.
Eventually, we'll work through the rest and figure out the worst of the bunch, and society will decide how to deal with them then.
The police didn't ask Cleveland to demo Frank's house.
I've never seen any police bashing of any sort on realneo, and we all depend on the police to protect and serve citizens, and I appreciate their help.
That said, it occurs to me, why don't the police spokespeople set up accounts on REALNEO and post crime reports directly here - it would not take them long and it would inform citizens well, and allow us to interact with the police on police related issues. I'd rather connect with the police on realneo than on the phone, or in person. And, I would like to be well informed about all crimes and police services of all types in my community.
This would be an excellent application of organic groups, on REALNEO, and we can establish a taxonomy appropriate to how the police categorize crime, location, etc. Very easily, that can map live, so we will have a google maps of crimes, so to speak (but open source). Add police scanner online if you like... that will be interesting.
We can start by getting police reports posted in an organized way on the core realneo - I'll make a few updates to the taxomony (needed anyways... e.g., we have a bunch of neighborhoods listed as categories and don't even include Tremont).
Who wants to contact the police about posting on REALNEO?
Submitted by Norm Roulet on Thu, 01/01/2009 - 04:16.
When you post content to REALNEO you have the option to select some categories called Community Of Interest Links, which include listings of area "Communities". This hadn't been updated since the early days of REALNEO, and is missing quite a few neighborhoods... like Tremont.
I added Tremont, Collinwood, University Circle, Old Brooklyn, and Cleveland Heights... and will fill this out to include a more complte listing.
I started tagging Tremont content with the Tremont tag and encourage you to do the same, for Tremont or wherever, as applies to your postings going forward. If you edit one of your old postings and a new tag applies, add that tag. This is one way to help visitors sort through the content on the site.
I'm sure we'll be updating these categories and add free tagging and better related navigation as we move along - it is easy enough to do - feel free to point out other neighborhoods, additions and changes.
Submitted by Jeff Schuler on Sun, 12/07/2008 - 15:00.
I understand -- and admire your ardor.
Only that it makes it easier when re-visiting a topic -- or for visitors, searchers, commenters, and those just joining in -- that the story be painted in relatively concise way.
Yesterday's Plain Dealer front page featured a picture of a broken helmet. My mate handed off the section to me--saying "you can have the SPORTS section." You know what I am driving at here--we have lost all directness, honesty and transpansparency in NEO and the irony is lost on everyone. "Frank" means javelin and honesty. I wish there was a way to shed light and make a direct and true story visible to NEO. I resort to linking to the attention grabbing posts, so, in a way, I follow the mainstream media's approach.
Frank is an older name than Francis. Like Francis, it is an English
form of the French name François, from the Germanic tribe "the Franks".
It is highly possible that the name was first derived in English from
the Germanic 'franca' meaning "javelin, spear", rather than to its
Latin counterpart 'francus' meaning "free".
Frank can be used as a nickname for many names, including Francis and Franklin.
Frank was arrested on a Thursday and released on Friday. The demolition took place on a Tuesday. Does this mean CPD had the premises under surveillance during the interim? So they would (should) have complete knowledge of what was removed from the home and by whom, correct?
It also shows the arrest was not made prior to the demo, but when the city came into Frank's home to remove valuables. Was Frank given proper notice (so he could dispose of these valuables himself)? Frank was present during the actual demolition and video shows he was calm.
The police have mace on their belts. If Sophie (Frank's dog)were indeed malicious and charging, wouldn't mace be a more appropriate response, rather than drawing deadly weapons? doesn't the officers' choice of guns, rather than mace, suggest their intention to incite Frank?
Commander Sulzer also does not mention the incident between 2nd district officers, Frank, Ted Theilander and Chuck Hoven that took place the day after the demolition. The officers (backed by three squad cars) approached Frank as he was talking to the other two men on the tree lawn of the property. The officers insisted the three men disperse. When the men questioned the officers as to why they would have to move on, the officers threatened them with arrest. When the men asked the officers why they would be arrested, the officers replied that they could arrest them for whatever they felt like, they would make it up. perhaps the officers didnt realize they were confronting a newspaper reporter?
BTW, this was reported by Henry on Tremonter.com. I went back to find the original post for excerpting. Not only could I not find this post, there is no longer any reference to Frank, or his situation at all. I know there were at least two topic posts regarding the situation, one was resurrected from the time of the original destruction of Frank's property by the city, 9 or 10 years ago by current commenting. Both are gone.
Submitted by Norm Roulet on Thu, 01/01/2009 - 11:56.
I believe most of the problems with police relations here come down to our pansy-ass, sell-out mainstream media here. I'm sick of reading anyone's words via the Plain Dealer - they have lost all credibility with me - and they are the lens we have had on all police matters in our lives. Result... you live in the middle of that...
What I would like to see is the police interacting with citizens here, as well as on the streets, in a positive way.
It seems the police have evidence on Frank's demolition and the theft of his personal property, so they are involved in future litigation no matter what they like. So, they will be deposed, and their records will be forced into court.
They should immediately clear up matters like who called them each time they came to Frank's house, who set the policy on police surveillance there... and regarding the Cimperman arson case, still unsolved (spending taxpayer money on that), and who said to a citizen "they could arrest them for whatever they felt like, they would make it up"
Any other direct questions for police representatives and police officers to clear up regarding this matter? Your equests are public information, here. You can expect to get answers.
Police - you say you want to set the record straight IN YOUR WORDS. Here is an excellent place to do that.
I'm still waiting (1 1/2 years later) for my public info request from 2nd District with regard to calls to Envy lounge... EMS and Fire managed to respond, but absolutely nothing from 2nd district. Phone calls regarding the matter have all been diverted, no answers.
it seems CPD have rules of their own.
I did jury duty with a 2nd District officer. He explained to me that one of the biggest beefs among the cops is with administration. All management is by mayoral appointment - it doesnt come about by seniority or accomplishment. So a hard working cop on the street has no hope of administrative promotion unless he sucks up and plays politics. Smacks of cronyism and is ripe for undue influence and extraordinary executive power.
Submitted by Norm Roulet on Thu, 01/01/2009 - 14:37.
It sounds like the police answer to the Mayor, one way or another, so the Mayor must be asked to arrange for the CPD to interact with citizens on REALNEO, and through other first-world technologies.
real.coop, realneo and the County will take the lead in getting Cleveland and the other neighboring communities using technology better - they have been steered toward third world strategies by third world technologists in town.
We'll start by empowering the police to use FOSS social computing to perfom their duties more effectively, and provide higher value and service to the community. I believe all real police officers will appreciate this very much. If they have something to hide, they will not.
That will apply to Mayor Jackson as well. It is his decision to make so these are his lessons to learn, or perish in the new economy.
Mayor Jackon, who do we contact to arrange for CPD spokespeople to interact with citizens on our world-class, bleeding edge, free, open source, not-for-profit, citizen controlled co-operative social network and content management system for the economic development of the region... the one and only REALNEO?
Dbra--don't feel embarassed. I am supposed to know how to find information and I feel like a mouse in a maze. Jerleen has the right idea--get everything in print in the Plain Press--which, by the way, OCNW, is archived in microfilm. So, you will need to go down to CSU and CPL and destroy those copies, too.
Apparently, Frank Giglio's house in Tremont was demolished today. So much for sharing and caring and community and holiday spirit in NEO.
Printer-friendly version
Frank's House and Tremont cleansing
See Tremonter for some of the latest on Frank and his house, as well as usual banter on cleansing in Tremont, and a touch of name-calling.
Here's a bit more history:
Not demolished
Franks house was not demolished. Upper-level windows have been removed. I'm not sure what else.
Frank was arrested and held in jail for about 3 days, then threatened arrest again.
He was in his parked car with his dog last night, and when I returned this morning. The workers (that he believes were scrapping the aluminum from his windows) were not there today. He mentioned concern for his cats and dog and the belongings in his house.
He believes his rights have been violated by the city, and could use representation.
-
-
Ohio City Near
Development Corp.
Safety Updates
1) We had some excitement in the neighborhood last week. Please see the following Plain Dealer article for details:
Posted by djmiller [at] plaind [dot] com" target="_blank" title="mailto:djmiller [at] plaind [dot] com">Donna J. Miller/Plain Dealer Reporter December 23, 2008 10:46AM
CPD: 2 carjackings, 2 rapid-response arrests and recoveries
CLEVELAND - An off-duty female security guard was carjacked at gunpoint about 4:50 p.m. Monday. Within minutes, the suspects were arrested and her car -- with her gun inside -- was returned, thanks to speedy police work. That same fast action reunited a toddler with her mother Sunday, when another carjacker took a car that held the woman's sleeping daughter. Police said this is what happened Monday: A 39-year-old Northfield woman was visiting family on Central Avenue. She was getting things out of the trunk of her Ford Contour. Two men walked up. One pulled out a silver semi-automatic handgun and ordered her to give up her keys. She did. The men drove the car to the 2000 block of West 25th Street, where, at 5:09 p.m., they robbed the Game Shop at gunpoint. They fled with money and merchandise. Cleveland patrol officers spotted the Contour within minutes near West 44th Street and Lorain Avenue. The suspects tried to flee, but crashed into another car. They bailed and ran. Officers chased them and had them in handcuffs at 5:19 p.m. The suspects refused to identify themselves. They're being held at the jail. Police returned the woman's car, her gun and the Game Shop property.
-----------------------------------------
Commander Sulzer advised me that after the two males bailed and ran, one was caught on Bridge Court (the alley north of Bridge) and the other was caught on Bailey. There were 13 officers that worked togther to apprehend these males though some very quick action. This was a great bust, and not only are two bad guys off the street, 3 guns are off the street as well (there was a gun in the trunk of the stolen car). I will be obtaining the names of the suspects for Court Watch purposes and keeping this email list posted.
2) We have $261.60 in the Police Appreciation Fund. Instead of spending this on food for the officers working Christmas Eve, I am following Commander Sulzer's suggestion to use this money to periodically recognize officers for outstanding service to the community. I plan to recognize two general patrol officers who work Zone 212 in our area. They were also involved in the apprehension and arrest of the 2 males in the above report. They will be recognized for their outstanding day-to-day service to our community. I'll provide details at a later date.
3) For those of you that read the January edition of the Plain Press, some crucial facts were omitted from a particular article, "Frank Giglio's historic house demolished while police guard the W.14th Street site". The following facts were omitted, as per Commander Sulzer:
I think it is important to report these facts, especially since the Plain Press is widely distributed in our community. I contacted the Plain Press to report these facts before they would run the article and they refused to verify them with Commander Sulzer or include the facts in their article. The reason why the Plain Press failed to do so is that they consider Commander Sulzer to be (and I quote) "a non credible source" for this article. This Plain Press article is making its way into various blogs, and there is no one there to report these facts or defend the actions of the CPD. I feel it is appropriate for this email list to know the other side of the story.
Bob Shores
OCNW Safety & Outreach Coordinator
PH 781-3222 (ext. 103)
Fax 781-3252
bshores [at] ohiocity [dot] org
____________________________________________________________
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Can we get the police spokespeople to communicate on REALNEO?
I'm really glad to see the Cleveland police communicate with some of the community by email, and this is an informative and professional communication. I'm glad you posted it.
I can understand demo crews and police being concerned about going anywhere near a man being thrown out on the street, from his home, who certainly will be overwhelmingly upset, and may have a shotgun... that is a recipe for intentional and unintentional killings.
I remember Detective Schroeder.
That Cleveland "leadership" allowed police and citizens to be in such risk to acellerate a dubious if not unlawful demo is disgraceful. If I was a cop put in that situation I would be pissed.
I've never considered the police a cause of the problem here, from what I've read.
The problems are the people who put Franks property at the front of the line for demo, and those who gave them the motivation and money and political amunition to do that, and those who did not defend it for historical importance, and those who did not help Frank out of human or even godly goodness, and those who stole physical property of his, and those who menaced him in any unreasonable way, which seems to easily add up to 20-30 real shitty human beings, with real names and plans for their futures, running around our community, taking community money, and screwing over someone certainly under duress, if not mental impairment.
Perhaps if some these 20-30 people come forward and take responsibility and clear their names, we can get Frank's life in much better shape.
Eventually, we'll work through the rest and figure out the worst of the bunch, and society will decide how to deal with them then.
The police didn't ask Cleveland to demo Frank's house.
I've never seen any police bashing of any sort on realneo, and we all depend on the police to protect and serve citizens, and I appreciate their help.
That said, it occurs to me, why don't the police spokespeople set up accounts on REALNEO and post crime reports directly here - it would not take them long and it would inform citizens well, and allow us to interact with the police on police related issues. I'd rather connect with the police on realneo than on the phone, or in person. And, I would like to be well informed about all crimes and police services of all types in my community.
This would be an excellent application of organic groups, on REALNEO, and we can establish a taxonomy appropriate to how the police categorize crime, location, etc. Very easily, that can map live, so we will have a google maps of crimes, so to speak (but open source). Add police scanner online if you like... that will be interesting.
Good example how open source social computing will evolve the experiences of living in Northeast Ohio.
We can start by getting police reports posted in an organized way on the core realneo - I'll make a few updates to the taxomony (needed anyways... e.g., we have a bunch of neighborhoods listed as categories and don't even include Tremont).
Who wants to contact the police about posting on REALNEO?
Disrupt IT
I added "Tremont" and some other neighborhoods to "Communities"
When you post content to REALNEO you have the option to select some categories called Community Of Interest Links, which include listings of area "Communities". This hadn't been updated since the early days of REALNEO, and is missing quite a few neighborhoods... like Tremont.
I added Tremont, Collinwood, University Circle, Old Brooklyn, and Cleveland Heights... and will fill this out to include a more complte listing.
I started tagging Tremont content with the Tremont tag and encourage you to do the same, for Tremont or wherever, as applies to your postings going forward. If you edit one of your old postings and a new tag applies, add that tag. This is one way to help visitors sort through the content on the site.
I'm sure we'll be updating these categories and add free tagging and better related navigation as we move along - it is easy enough to do - feel free to point out other neighborhoods, additions and changes.
Disrupt IT
All related
Thanks JeffS and JeffB, for following up on this injustice.
I posted to JeffB's coverage of the Baker Nord series, because--this excellent series at Case Western Reserve University attempts to understand conditions of broad human interest in Northeast Ohio and to promote dialogue to improve conditions for all of us.
scattershot stories
I understand -- and admire your ardor.
Only that it makes it easier when re-visiting a topic -- or for visitors, searchers, commenters, and those just joining in -- that the story be painted in relatively concise way.
Sports
Yesterday's Plain Dealer front page featured a picture of a broken helmet. My mate handed off the section to me--saying "you can have the SPORTS section." You know what I am driving at here--we have lost all directness, honesty and transpansparency in NEO and the irony is lost on everyone. "Frank" means javelin and honesty. I wish there was a way to shed light and make a direct and true story visible to NEO. I resort to linking to the attention grabbing posts, so, in a way, I follow the mainstream media's approach.
Frank is an older name than Francis. Like Francis, it is an English
form of the French name François, from the Germanic tribe "the Franks".
It is highly possible that the name was first derived in English from
the Germanic 'franca' meaning "javelin, spear", rather than to its
Latin counterpart 'francus' meaning "free".
Frank can be used as a nickname for many names, including Francis and Franklin.
Used on its own, Frank can have the additional meaning of "sincere."
I'm confused...
Frank was arrested on a Thursday and released on Friday. The demolition took place on a Tuesday. Does this mean CPD had the premises under surveillance during the interim? So they would (should) have complete knowledge of what was removed from the home and by whom, correct?
It also shows the arrest was not made prior to the demo, but when the city came into Frank's home to remove valuables. Was Frank given proper notice (so he could dispose of these valuables himself)? Frank was present during the actual demolition and video shows he was calm.
The police have mace on their belts. If Sophie (Frank's dog)were indeed malicious and charging, wouldn't mace be a more appropriate response, rather than drawing deadly weapons? doesn't the officers' choice of guns, rather than mace, suggest their intention to incite Frank?
Commander Sulzer also does not mention the incident between 2nd district officers, Frank, Ted Theilander and Chuck Hoven that took place the day after the demolition. The officers (backed by three squad cars) approached Frank as he was talking to the other two men on the tree lawn of the property. The officers insisted the three men disperse. When the men questioned the officers as to why they would have to move on, the officers threatened them with arrest. When the men asked the officers why they would be arrested, the officers replied that they could arrest them for whatever they felt like, they would make it up. perhaps the officers didnt realize they were confronting a newspaper reporter?
BTW, this was reported by Henry on Tremonter.com. I went back to find the original post for excerpting. Not only could I not find this post, there is no longer any reference to Frank, or his situation at all. I know there were at least two topic posts regarding the situation, one was resurrected from the time of the original destruction of Frank's property by the city, 9 or 10 years ago by current commenting. Both are gone.
Good questions for REAL NEO police spokespeople
I believe most of the problems with police relations here come down to our pansy-ass, sell-out mainstream media here. I'm sick of reading anyone's words via the Plain Dealer - they have lost all credibility with me - and they are the lens we have had on all police matters in our lives. Result... you live in the middle of that...
What I would like to see is the police interacting with citizens here, as well as on the streets, in a positive way.
It seems the police have evidence on Frank's demolition and the theft of his personal property, so they are involved in future litigation no matter what they like. So, they will be deposed, and their records will be forced into court.
They should immediately clear up matters like who called them each time they came to Frank's house, who set the policy on police surveillance there... and regarding the Cimperman arson case, still unsolved (spending taxpayer money on that), and who said to a citizen "they could arrest them for whatever they felt like, they would make it up"
Any other direct questions for police representatives and police officers to clear up regarding this matter? Your equests are public information, here. You can expect to get answers.
Police - you say you want to set the record straight IN YOUR WORDS. Here is an excellent place to do that.
Disrupt IT
good luck
I'm still waiting (1 1/2 years later) for my public info request from 2nd District with regard to calls to Envy lounge... EMS and Fire managed to respond, but absolutely nothing from 2nd district. Phone calls regarding the matter have all been diverted, no answers.
it seems CPD have rules of their own.
I did jury duty with a 2nd District officer. He explained to me that one of the biggest beefs among the cops is with administration. All management is by mayoral appointment - it doesnt come about by seniority or accomplishment. So a hard working cop on the street has no hope of administrative promotion unless he sucks up and plays politics. Smacks of cronyism and is ripe for undue influence and extraordinary executive power.
Well the mayor needs to address this, then
It sounds like the police answer to the Mayor, one way or another, so the Mayor must be asked to arrange for the CPD to interact with citizens on REALNEO, and through other first-world technologies.
real.coop, realneo and the County will take the lead in getting Cleveland and the other neighboring communities using technology better - they have been steered toward third world strategies by third world technologists in town.
We'll start by empowering the police to use FOSS social computing to perfom their duties more effectively, and provide higher value and service to the community. I believe all real police officers will appreciate this very much. If they have something to hide, they will not.
That will apply to Mayor Jackson as well. It is his decision to make so these are his lessons to learn, or perish in the new economy.
Mayor Jackon, who do we contact to arrange for CPD spokespeople to interact with citizens on our world-class, bleeding edge, free, open source, not-for-profit, citizen controlled co-operative social network and content management system for the economic development of the region... the one and only REALNEO?
Disrupt IT
Censorship and the new media
This is my concern about any electronic media--the ability to change the reality. Frank still owns his property as of today, right (despite mounting liens)? There are constitutional breaches here. The police are supposed to help him protect his property, not the other way around. Also, since when is OCNW in the business of presenting "the facts?" Perhaps, they should take this story to the Plain Dealer, so that it has an accounting that will be archived for future access?
-
-
Plain Press
Dbra--don't feel embarassed. I am supposed to know how to find information and I feel like a mouse in a maze. Jerleen has the right idea--get everything in print in the Plain Press--which, by the way, OCNW, is archived in microfilm. So, you will need to go down to CSU and CPL and destroy those copies, too.
Chuck Hoven is an urban saint and no one will take that mantle away from him. In the six degrees of separation game, I worked with his brother at MetroHospital in the eighties. Speak the truth in a quiet and steady voice and you will be heard.